"I'm what we call a culture Christian."
They have Clutural Jews, so why not? I'm Protistand in outlook more than in any other respect.
I once heard a quote:
"Your beliefs don't make you a better person, your behaiviour does."
It just couldn't have been said better. I, personally, don't believe in anything supernatural, but I still don't consider myself an atheist, neither an agnostic (because there are little details that make it different). BUT I don't mock people for having religions etc.
It's just when people start bashing others' human rights because of their beliefs, I feel angry. At the point where people start saying "hating gays and opposing abortion is a part of my religion!!!1", their words become really tasteless. Oh, treating a certaing group of people badly because of the way the were born is a part of your religion? Wow.
Being gay doesn't hurt anyone.
Discriminating and even killing people because of one's beliefs does.
Nothing wrong with Christianity itself, though. I even know openly and proudly gay Christians and completely straight Christians who think that sexual minorities should have the same rights as everyone else.
Christian =/= intolerant asshole
Christian = believes in Jesus and stuff
At it's best, religion can be a source of emotional power etc., and so on.
I accept if some people are uncomfortable with gays or abortion. But these people feeling uncomfy don't have to be gay or abort their fetuses themselves. But those who do, they should leave alone. The problem is when these people make LBGT people's lives more difficult by spreading homophobia and trying prohibit women's (or other people's who have a uterus) right to choose what to do with their own damn bodies.
Jeeze, this world would be a better place if people were tolerant and not trying to force their preferences and beliefs on, for example, on their own children (think about gay children who grow up in a homophobic family... some end up killing themselves.. That's why EVERYONE should be able to be educated about how diverse can sexuality be and how it's all okay. It goes against children's rights to teach some kids that they're bad and wrong, and to the other kids to bully this different kid.)
My only belief is that you can do whatever you want if it doesn't mean stepping on other people's toes. I think nothing gives anyone a right to take rights away from a certain group of people or to teach others to hate this group of people.
"You shall not murder." - Exodus 20:13
Where did the moral compass come from? Who made it? Why is it wrong?
That's just my belief, of course, you're allowed to disagree.
Your religion only extends to the beginning of time if you believe in its concept of time. Which many people on this earth, both alive and dead do not, or have not.
Do you know what caused me to be an agnostic, way, way back when I was a pre-teen attending a Christian school? (I presume you will be interested in this because of the other enthusiastic discussions you've had trying to save people's souls and I'm always intrigued to see if one day I'll come across someone who actually makes me change my mind (though I doubt it).)
Younger Me: "Wait a second... if you can only go to heaven if you believe in Jesus being the son of God, (because this is the only way he can absolve you of your sins, principally the Original Sin we all possess,) then that means all the millions of people who existed before Jesus, and the millions of people who existed after and had never heard of him because they lived in say... South America, are all currently in Hell. Or (if you're Catholic) limbo. Either way... what the eff?"
Your ability to gain an afterlife of peace is dependant on a factor which could well be out of your control... erm, no. I'm sorry. All those unbaptised babies and tribesmen and women, our ancestors, people who loved, and nourished, and fought, and struggled, just like us, all going straight to hell, simply for being human, without even being given a chance at redemption? By a God who could have given them one? Well if that's how He treats the rest of humanity not blessed with existing at a feasible time and place to have heard about Jesus, I'm not praising Him. No way. Because that's not justice. That's not even balance. And I'm not sure there's any theological manouver you could pull to make me see this otherwise.
Also - side note, unrelated, but I feel the need to say this outloud for some reason, probably completely unrelated to this thread - Satan is not Evil, he is the Accuser, he is there to remind God of all our failings and sin, and tempt us into showing our "true colours". He is not evil itself. We do that by ourselves, and it frustrates me no end that so many Christians fail to make this distinction. God is omnipotent yes? Omniscient? Then God permits evil to exist. He allows Satan to exist, Satan is, at no point, capable of taking over the universe. Only showing the universe to be as evil as he claims it really is. He is however capable of making you put your own soul at risk. I guess why this popped into my head isn't the whole "but God lets evil happen" shtick, because honestly, I see the logic to God doing that and still loving us... it's more that, the Bible (and probably the Torah and Qu'ran, though I have no idea,) has a really negative view of humanity from the outset. From the start it says: humans, really, we're all evil inside. We all hate, and are jealous, and do horrible things - even before we do them, we think them, because really we're all bad eggs. Inside. We are all bad. And it doesn't follow this up with "But that's okay, because it's human. What matters is, that you try to make it right. That you try to do good things too, that you try to live well and make the world a better place because in the end, you will be happier, and more at peace, society will be happier and more secure, and the world can keep on going."
Oh no, instead it says: "But that's okay, because it's human, what matters is that you realise this, and that you are an insignificant spec compared to God, and God will judge you for the bad you do. And if you don't try harder to be good, God will punish you either now, or in the next life, so you better pay him the proper respect [Old Testament] ... but if you just believe in him, believe in the power of his son to wash away your sins, and apologise... just apologise, and mean it, and try to live a better life, then God will deign to forgive you for just being human." For being precicely what he created us to be! And that's the New Testament.
Basically God's acceptance of our human foibles, his love, is contingent on us loving him back. I get that, I see the reasoning behind it, but... what if I don't need God's love. God's love where I'm never good enough for Him, inherently evil and in need of Him to behave positively - i.e. dependent on him? What if I can not only exist without God's love, but behave positively to other people, and apologise, and forgive - even live a saintly life - and live in peace and harmony with others, and my own instincts... without Him? Why then, would I seek His love? Why then, need I enter into all his conditions on this unconditional love? Not the Do not murder part - no one is arguing that - the believe in his son, part. And if you don't believe in Jesus being the son of God, you are not Christian.
Anyway, it's late, and I've either bored you to tears, angered you, upset you, or (hopefully) intellectually stimulated you. I'd be interested to hear your response though I must admit, I'm not on DA regularly these days and may not respond for some time.
PS The other guy was right, I understand your need to "prod" at people's beliefs, to test them, and hopefully show them their error, but most other people won't. To them it does just feel like bullying, because its unsolicited, and they (usually) don't believe you have a right to question their beliefs. All I would add to that is... please, I implore everyone, to be sensitive when someone clearly does not wish to engage further and respect that right. If they're not causing this-worldly-harm to other people, then there comes a point where you should back off, because they have a right not to be harassed. [I'm not accusing you of this btw, this is more a general thought for all evangelicals and proselytisers out there.] Also, I apologise in advance if you were over this discussion like a wet Tuesday and had hoped to be left alone... :S I will stop soap-boxing now... Sorry.
Also, by your definition Adam and Eve were thereby Jewish? Which again relies on your interpretation of Judaism as being something inhereted from them, rather than as an organised religion created later which traces its origins from them. Because - clearly - Adam and Eve did not abide by the laws of Leviticus, say, or the Ten Commandments. Likewise they are not described as practicing any number of prayers, recitations of a holy book - which was not written until at least after Noah - going to, or creating, a synaggogue (sp?) or temple, wearing ritual clothing, ensuring they are clean before entering holy places... or basically anything which one might actually consider Jewish. The only exception being a belief in the same monotheistic deity. Incidentally, a deity in which they did not actually believe in, because they had proof of his existence. They had an active relationship with a deity which had an obvious and direct impact on their lives. They never doubted God existed. They knew. Ergo, they did not believe.
There is no civility in dealing with trash like you.
I have seen mothers wailing and crying out because their children are dead. I have been to the darkest part of the world and seen sicknesses that your mind can hardly conceive. I have been there and seen that and I am still here.
I am trash. We all are. There is nothing good in any man. But God has made a way for sinner to become saint, and that is what you refuse to believe. You do not want to believe that there is mercy in Heaven, and all becausit would affect the way you live.
I have a cure for an illness that you and millions like you are dying of, but you will not swallow it.
Where have you been?
And your god is a psychopath. He wants us to be happy and he loves us, but if we don't love him back he condemns us to eternal suffering? Yeah, that doesn't sound like an abusive boyfriend or anything.
As for what I'm dying of, it's this odd little condition called mortality. You should watch out, it's been going around for a long while.
I agree with you. for me, I don't want to be religious or read the bible. the bible is boring....I mean it may have some interesting points to it about how humans appeared on earth and how the universe was born, but other then that its just a boring old book. and for me, I don't believe in god to be honest. I think god is...well...I think god is a myth. a fairytale, just like mermaids, vampires, zombies, fairies, ghosts or whatever fantasy creature you hear about. I'm more of in the middle of agnostic and atheist in my mind. but that's just me, I respect everyone else's opinions because that's what I polite person would do.